A Council-led bid could see 50 electric, zero-emission buses on the roads of the city and the Rame peninsula.
The Department for Transport is making £129m available to support the introduction of the buses in England and the Council is leading a bid to the Zero Emission Bus Regional Areas (ZEBRA) scheme, in partnership with Plymouth Citybus Ltd (part of The Go-Ahead Group Ltd) and Cornwall Council.
If successful the bid will see the introduction of 50 zero-emission, electric, double- decker buses on routes operating in Plymouth and the Rame peninsula as well as the necessary associated charging infrastructure at the Plymouth Citybus depot in Milehouse.
This will mean better transport to places of work, education, leisure and healthcare and improvements in air quality. It will also strongly support the climate change ambitions in our Net Zero Action Plan.
Councillor Mark Coker, Cabinet Member for Strategic Planning and Transport said: “If successful, this bid will not only mean we can introduce modern, zero-emission buses on some of our key routes but also cascade existing Euro 6 diesel buses displaced from electrified routes onto other services in Plymouth and South-East Cornwall, modernising the Plymouth Citybus fleet in the Plymouth travel-to-work area.”
Councillor Tom Briars-Delve, Cabinet Member for Environment and Climate Change, added: “Cutting emissions from the transport sector is a top priority for the Council and its partners. The introduction of electric buses within Plymouth and its wider travel-to-work area would be an important step on our path towards net zero whilst supporting cleaner air. Our ZEBRA bid shows how seriously the Council is taking climate change locally.”
The value of the bid is around £34 million, with the Council making a financial contribution (funded from the Community Infrastructure Fund levy) of £750,000.
The deadline for bids is 4pm on Friday 15 December and the outcome is due to be announced by April.
https://www.plymouth.gov.uk/council-bids-zero-emission-buses
Fingers crossed that this time Plymouth actually gets the money – its certainly needed!
Depends what we get, everywhere else that has got funding has only received Wright Streetdeck EVs. Citybus really does need to get it's act together and go back to the post takeover rebrand era, those Wright B7RLE's were exactly the direction Citybus should have been going livery, interior and presentation wise.
ReplyDeleteThere are plenty of the new Enviro 400 EV bus due to operators as well as the new Volvo MCV double decker being delivered for operators so there is a choice. Be hard to imagine they would get anything else other than the ADL. Also disagree with the Volvo B7RLEs. Very nice for some routes but hated getting then on the 50/51s as you could never get a seat. The new E400s we started getting were by far the better buses for city passengers.
DeleteJames, at this very moment, it doesn't matter, because we do not have the funds (yet, if it all). And as for Wright / Volvo / ADL / Yutong etc - who gives two monkeys? if it gets you from A to B (something they struggle with atm), we'll be happier than we are now.
DeleteWon't happen, plymouth constantly gets shafted with second hand cast offs that nobody wants, time for go-ahead to either invest heavily in plymouth or hand over the reins to stagecoach as its clear go-ahead don't care about devin or Cornwall just like with first group did with western national
ReplyDeleteGA have invested a lot more in Devon & Cornwall than Stagecoach have over the last few years. The last new buses for SC Devon was 5 years ago. As with the rest of the country at the moment - its the government that decides who gets the money for new buses. Devon in particular has done quite poorly so far. Plymouth is due some 'newer' buses from elsewhere in the group in the meantime displaced from areas that have received government money
DeleteAnon - the bid is being led by Cornwall Council, not GoAhead. If successful it will be for the council to allocate the funding to the operator and services stated in its bid.
Deleteindeed, Plymouth have received the not so good cast offs, but that also comes down to Plymouth saying okay in the first place... in terms of the newer buses coming down, it will be interesting to see where from, considering from what JB has been saying, that they could potentially by from 2015 or younger - which actually puts Oxford E200MMCs as a possibility.
DeleteZEBRA bids have to be led by a council but, unless the council are paying for the buses (ZEBRA pays for some of the difference between diesel & electric, not all the cost) then there will be an operator partner (or more than one) involved. Also the bidding process does require the council to know broadly what the buses will be used on, the evaluation includes expected mileages & fuel/emissions savings and these bids are assessed once the vehicles enter service in so councils are careful about ensuring they are accurate (at least ours is) so they need to be sure that the operator can operate them - one of the big hurdles is getting charging infrastructure in place, we have had one bid fall apart due to the cost of connecting the depot to the grid and the amount of work required to charge the buses due to the standard of the local electricity grid.
DeleteWhen looking at group investment you do need to look at what else the group has had to deal with, Plymouth may not have seen investment but that is probably as much to do with what has happened elsewhere to the Go-Ahead group as it is to issues with Plymouth. Manchester (mostly cascades but they have to come from somewhere), Cornwall, Southampton & the currently ongoing replacement of almost the entire Oxford fleet with electrics as part of the previous ZEBRA rounds will all have tied up group resources. If Go-Ahead are partners in this bid then it does show that Plymouth is in the thinking for upgrades going forward.
Anyone got any better quality photos than that? What citaro is it… I assume it was just a spare one that has been made roadworthy, rather than pulling one from the training fleet?
ReplyDeleteIt’s 94, the picture that has shared is a mock up of the proposed livery on 84, not an actual photo of the finished article. If you look about the front wheel arch you can see the fleet number, the front near side indicator is the 55plate shape, and the flip dot side destination give it away. As well as it saying ‘driver training’ and still having a section of the swoop on the glass!
DeleteSlightly out of our area I know but Stagecoach are venturing East into Somerset. They will operate all Taunton Park and Ride services from February. Operated from Tiverton outstation
DeleteStagecoach for Truro park and ride?
DeleteI wouldn't rule it out, although it is unlikely as Stagecoach would need to set up a base in Truro. Taunton can be operated from Tiverton outstation as the two towns are not far apart.
DeleteTaunton P&R will be run with deckers, apparently. Does anyone know where they're coming from? Surely SD doesn't have sufficient spares in the existing fleet to cover it?
DeleteLots of Stagecoach subsidiaries are getting new double deckers at the moment (diesels and electrics) so there should be enough to cascade from somewhere down to South West for Taunton Park & Ride. I wouldn't be surprised if the last Tridents (possibly with the exception of Torquay's semi-open toppers) are withdrawn this year.
DeleteAccording to Oxford & Chiltern Bus Page, Oxford Bus Company's 251-254 are coming to Go South West.
ReplyDeleteThey are ADL E400s, HW63FHC, FHD, FHE & FHF. They were originally for Southern Vectis, hence the reg nos, but never got there.
They'll be the only compatible ones most probably, also fairly nice. Never been hybrid and are original E400s, similar to our 63/65 plates.
DeleteWe’re actually getting decent hand-me-downs?? Miracle 🤣
DeleteUnless in typical GSW fashion they get sent to TFC and they’ll send some old ex London Enviros back up to Plymouth that are currently down in TFC depots.
I think any E400s that arrive will probably be very welcome as then we may see the back of the Scania Omnidekkas which have seen better days.
Deletei unfortunately don't think these will see off the Scanias any time soon - there is only four arriving. the other E400s at Oxf, are unsuitable for Plym.
DeleteWell if these buses from Oxford do come down, what are they likely to replace? If anything? The scanias's are well past their best yes, but they're relied upon for school routes, I assume thats because they're old and battered and can cope with the damage/abuse from school kids. I assume PCB wouldn't keep them as dedicated school buses, which to be fair wouldn't be a bad shout. The remaining ex London E400's aren't in that great condition, including the 4000's which have only relatively recently been convrted and put into service, which I personally think is a total waste of time and money.
DeleteOr... the remaining "reserve" unconverted dual-door E400's - 478, 488, 489 - could potentially be used as school buses if left unconverted? I don't know if these are even still down at Milehouse and if they're in a reasonable condition or not, considering they were withdrawn from service a good while ago now. Knowing GSW they've probably been gutted and are wrecked on the gravelpit. I've not been down to Milehouse in ages as I'm not in the area at the moment.
Last i saw of 478 488 489 and truro bridge e400 they were parked in winkleigh as i beleve gsw still rent land there after the demise of go devon but this was in October
DeleteWinkleigh!! Christ thats a bit out of the way, considering Go Devon is a thing of the past.
DeleteI guess they are basically “withdrawn” and not in reserve.
I always liked the double door ones though, was always a nice surprise when the driver actually opened the middle door as well.
Electric is not the future
ReplyDeleteFor buses in Cities it will work, especially London & Manchester. But agreed for rural services it won't.
DeleteIt is very much the future. No point being in denial.
DeleteIs Electric currently sustainable? - No, Is there any mainstream alternatives at the moment? - No. Is there pressure from Government to reach Net Zero targets - Yes. For now, electric ia actually very much the present, and not the future, whereas alternative fuels, and even Sustainable Fuels are being tested as we speak. I suspect a very large part of the bus network will eventually end up being Hydrogen, when it eventually also becomes sustainable - Electric Battery vehicles will be upgradable to Hydrogen also, as the store of Hydrogen can be converted into Electricity on board.
DeleteThe big issue with electric is that there is simply nor enough rare earth metals to be able to electrify / replace all the vehicles the world has. Plus the ivery significant. ssues around the mining and recycling of REMs. Electric is not the only future, sustainable duels might be.
DeleteSorry about the typos in my message at 11:01 - on my phone, on a coach and I wasn't loged in. What I should also have added was the serious lack of sufficient battery recycling facilities currently in existence worldwide. This, combined with the issues of extracting the necessary rare earth metals in the first place is, in some quarters, being seen as just as big a potential environmental catastrophe as burning fossil fuels is. The truth is, no-one knows what the future is As BusGuy says, electric is the present for now to some extent but has major problems to overcome, certainly with cars where sales are currently stagnating due to their high purchase price, charging costs, range anxiety, lack of charging infrasructure, escalating insurance costs, potential mid-life battery replacement costs, excessive accident repair costs, lack of EV technicians and the enhanced risk of dificult to extinquish fires. Buses may actually be a better EV proposition than cars in many respects due to fleet economies of scale and the size of the vehicles potentially meaning that the batteries may be able to be better protected and less vulnerable to damage. Hydrogen has its own issues to resolve, from creating the gas in first place, through to ensuring the a guarantee of supply, which has seen the buses in London, Aberdeen and Crawley all off the road to varying degrees at times when fuel suplies haven't been available. Indeed Metrobus has a fleet of 20 delivered in the spring/summer 2023 but is still only able to put out half-a-dozen at any one time and some days none at all. Some haven't been used since June.
DeleteDon't be so sure. The battery technology is coming on in leaps and bounds and ADL are promoting the suitability of their new Enviro100 EV and Enviro400 EV for interurban and rural work.
ReplyDelete