The changing of the guard is starting to manifest itself on VOSA. Yesterday saw the cancellations from First Devon & Cornwall:
PH0004983/32 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Tavistock Bus Station and Plymouth Royal Parade given service number 83/83A/86 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/35 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between TORPOINT FERRY and PLYMOUTH Bus Station given service number 81/81D effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/36 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Dartmouth Pontoon and Dartmouth Pontoon given service number 90/90A/90B/90C effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/38 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Kingsbridge Quay and Dartmouth Pontoon given service number 93 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/75 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Roborough Bypass and Tor Bridge High given service number 804/805 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/120 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Woolwell and Coombe Dean School given service number 808/807/809 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/144 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between NR MOLTON Bridge and CHIPPENHAMPTON Square given service number 855/856/859 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/145 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between EAST ANSTEY Froude Arms and TAWSTOCK given service number NOT AV. effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/186 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between PLYMOUTH Bretonside Bus Station and LAUNCESTON Westgate Street given service number 76 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/278 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between THE GEORGE PARK AND RIDE SITE and PLYMOUTH (Royal Parade) given service number PR1 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/294 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Coypool Park & Ride Site and Royal Parade given service number PR2 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/307 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Tavistock Bus Station and Courtlands given service number 89 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/335 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Plymouth Royal Parade and Saltash given service number 1/1A effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/336 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Plymouth Royal Parade and St Budeaux Square given service number 3 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/337 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Plymouth Royal Parade and Mount Batten given service number 2 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/389 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Plymouth, Royal Parade and Kingsbridge Quay given service number 93 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/396 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Plymouth City Centre and Woolwell, School Drive given service number 15/15A effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/401 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Harford Bridge and Tavistock given service number 1 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/402 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Lumburn Field and Tavistock given service number 2 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/403 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Yelverton and Tavistock given service number 3 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/429 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Wembury and Burrator given service number 48 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/430 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Barnstaple Bus Station and Croyde Bay, Ruda given service number 8 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/448 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Gunnislake Station and Okehampton Station given service number 187 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/463 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Plymouth, Royal Parade and Laira given service number 6/Purple effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/467 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between DEVONPORT and COOMBE DEAN SCHOOL given service number 806 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/471 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Exeter Bus Station and Princetown given service number 48 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/499 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Tavistock Bus Station and Callington, Callington School given service number 79 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
PH0004983/523 - FIRST DEVON & CORNWALL LTD, THE RIDE, CHELSON MEADOW, PLYMOUTH, PL9 7JT
- Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Milehouse Park & Ride and Milehouse Park & Ride given service number PR4 effective from 06-Sep-2015.
These will all be covered properly in future next Devon Transit.
Of course the more interesting items will come from Stagecoach over the coming days…
Further predictable Stagecoach registrations coming through today - Dartmouth P & R, Dartmoor Summer Services and Plymouth to Kingsbridge. Nothing on more interesting 'City' network or SE Cornwall yet!
ReplyDeleteAs per Graham and others posts, I don't see a massive new Stagecoach network for Plymouth but instead to go for almost a like for like replacement of First. Undoubtedly, there will have to be rationalisation but Stagecoach's position will be weakened if they unilaterally give up routes like Saltash before negotiations begin (unless they have already).
ReplyDeleteWish the anti-PCB brigade would give it a rest. If they were that bad, how come First never managed to dislodge them and ultimately couldn't make the area pay. I suspect Stagecoach will have more success as there will be a peace dividend (a reduction in competition) and they will look to develop some sadly neglected services
Well said.
DeleteHere here to the last comment. Bet Stagecoach will have better quality buses than First so lets look to the future
ReplyDeleteI agree to a point that SC may well not launch City wide network at first but they will also not simply just launch similar network to First. First made a loss for years in Plymouth, Stagecoach would do too if they just carry on as First did! I can not see them giving away Saltash unless 'cough' they have got something good in return! Torpoint may be a different matter, I would not be surprised to see PCB cancellation (s) soon, Tavistock especially
DeleteIt will be interesting to see what emerges over the coming days. Just because certain route numbers are already registered in the country means little - Stagecoach quite like route names, and of course are well used to route letters in Exeter.
DeleteThe way in which they are submitting Registrations may even be a tactic, do the obvious country routes first, and keep them guessing at Milehouse in the city, although that might be causing some nerves at the Civic Centre as they wonder what holes they might have to fill under tender.
As for Torpoint, that's a puzzle. Lots of dead mileage to run it from The Ride, and of course not just the mileage but the time on the ferry. And even in service it's two buses sat doing nothing all the time slowly chugging across the water. Conversely two operators for this long must mean there are fares to be had.
We live, as they say, in interesting times.
I cant see their VOSA registrations being part of any tactic,They have to register services by set deadlines which get published by VOSA. They cant delay any or hide them from the opposition in anyway. The rules are the same for all operators. SC dont not want to run into Torpoint. First were clearly not making any money there so why would SC want to run them at a loss as well?
DeleteFirst were always doing well in torpoint.
DeleteRealistically why would stagecoach buy a company that makes a loss and run it in the same way as first. They will have to cut it back and consolidate. It looks like they have focused on what will make them some money. This will leave pcb to focus on improving there services rather than worrying about what the others are doing. This can only be win win for the customers of Plymouth and that's what it is all about at the end of the day
ReplyDeleteAnon 12:51 here again!
ReplyDeleteClearly, both First AND Go Ahead have been hurting in Plymouth on the competitive corridors. GA thought that a weakened First may just walk away as in Northampton. That didn't happen and Stagecoach is clearly a more robust adversary and having purchased the operations, they won't be walking away soon. I'd be surprised if Stagecoach were to just surrender Saltash, Torpoint, Mount Batten et al unilaterally; they would expect that they will use those as bargaining chips in order to obtain the best settlement.
Similarly, I don't expect some large Stagecoach offensive into PCB territory. They have enough issues sourcing sufficient vehicles and managing the transition to contemplate that. However, if GA don't retreat from hitherto First territory, then Stagecoach may look at extending into the city.
Therefore, I think the initial registrations will be broadly similar to the First network but then they'll need to see what they've bought and assess the competitive environment; GA will also be looking at their competitive services and assessing the future.
I heard a First driver the other day say that theres going to be a bus war in Plymouth once Stagecoach come in, time to put the rip-off merchants that are PCB out of business
ReplyDeletePerhaps if First charged the correct fares to passengers then perhaps they would still be in business in Plymouth. Citybus are not rip-off merchants they charge what is required to run a business. It's looking very likely that SC are not running any additional services in Plymouth other than what is on VOSA now.
DeleteAh yes. Bus drivers and canteen talk. Always the most reliable of sources!
Deletewell I've noticed sc in exeter has reduced some fares it used to be £1.60 roughly from the high street to st David's station now only a £1 think that's good value myself sc have already got day tickets from ivy bridge into plymouth. hmm will they carry that across plymouth. also there explorer tickets are 7.50 and covers a larger area than pcb. maybe they will charge same as city bus who knows will have to wait and see!
DeleteLots of new SC registrations on VOSA today but still no Plymouth ones except Park And Rides and school ones. Sure there must be more ?
ReplyDeleteNot from what I have heard - thats it. Waiting to see though as things do change
DeleteThere are no 'negotiations' to be had.
ReplyDeleteStagecoach want a presence in the city, to protect the North and the East, to gain efficiencies by moving some workings into Plymouth from the East, the engineering base, and have an extra use for the base.
The depot is clearly the biggest draw for Stagecoach as they are desperate for space.
DeleteUnderstand that but surely they don't need to buy the whole operation just to obtain a depot? After all, they'll have all the transition costs and the historic liabilities.
DeleteAlso, bit of a difference in having drivers pootling around Saltash and getting them to do Megabus work.
They need the drivers too. They could have built a new depot from scratch but then finding a hundred or more drivers in one go is something else entirely. This way they're up and running quickly.
DeleteStagecoach will need to have a network as big as First at least to keep all the drivers in jobs, Plus leasing nearly 50 buses off First and whatever they are bringing in from day 1. So must be some city services coming soon on VOSA
ReplyDeleteIts believed that additional Megabus duties are coming to Plymouth soon so additional drivers will be needed for them as well.
DeleteMost of the buses are coming from reserve fleets .Oxford has got 10 plate Enviro 300s in reserve .Wales has got 40 E300s replaced this year so some will probably end up in Plymouth .Yorkshire has got 20 E400 on loan .
Deletehttp://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/Stagecoach-review-bus-network-takes-Plymouth/story-26901264-detail/story.html, this proves that theres going to be a bus war
ReplyDeleteAre we reading the same article? How does that prove there is to be a bus war? SC are clearly reviewing the routes and getting rid of the under performing ones (ie most of them). This article is more about preparing people for the cuts which are about to happen.
Delete